_[*Tenmillion] If you could give the top 3 factors that you think are the most important for an RV...
[*Tenmillion] what would they be...
[*Tenmillion] Enoch?
[*Tenmillion] Proteus?
[Enoch8] Who 1st?
[*Tenmillion] you if you want
[B.I.W.] flip a cion
[Proteus] oooh oooh OOOh pick me
[B.I.W.] coin
[B.I.W.] pro
[Proteus] ok
[*Tenmillion] and why you think these reasons are important
[Enoch8] haha.... go for it P
[Proteus] In my opinion there are many items that surround the facts of an rv
[*Tenmillion] can you give the top 3 first?
[Proteus] there is the draft laws, the erbil, chaptor 7 and many other things
[Enoch8] Hang on ....quik question?
[Proteus] but do they actually need to happen
[Proteus] the Rv is a banking process that is done thru a few step, that actually pertain to the event
[Proteus] the 3 things that I say in my opinion that will lead to an Rv are:
[Proteus] (1) parliament approves the 2012 budget into utilization
[Proteus] (2) the Ministry of Finance issues support oto the CBI for the process
[Proteus] (3) the CBI starts the process by issueing lower denoms into distribution points for conversion from the larger notes
[Proteus] is that 3?
[*Tenmillion] if you have more...add them too
[Proteus] ok... 1 more... the GOI makes a formal statement of RV with supported educational programs for the citizens to accept the difference in the notes!
[Proteus] I am not going to list them all... but those are my top 4 that actually need to happen
[B.I.W.] great
[B.I.W.] thanks
[B.I.W.] i know trying to list them all is hard
[B.I.W.] but at least we have a good starting point to work with
[B.I.W.] now if enoch8 would like to talk some we would love to here his honest take on iraq
[B.I.W.] please wait till the end
[B.I.W.] thanks
[B.I.W.] they each have their own minds
[B.I.W.] would you like to go next
[Proteus] I would just like to add
[B.I.W.] sure
[Proteus] that there are really many things all need to happen, but do they need to happen as a prelude
[Proteus] or do they have to happen simultaniously
[B.I.W.] i agree
[*Tenmillion] I agree
[Proteus] or do they have to happen simultaniously
[B.I.W.] i agree
[B.I.W.] please let every body know
[B.I.W.] this is what this is for
[B.I.W.] we want every body to know what we have found
[Proteus] but the items I listed pertain directly to the RV... not to the items that surround the RV
[B.I.W.] so they can make up their own minds
[Proteus] the banking system like the atricle TEN posted at the start of this chat
[Proteus] needs to be imporved
[Proteus] atm,s are part of that
[Proteus] the bond market needs implementating further
[Proteus] and lots of things
[Proteus] but is the CHAPTOR 7 holding it up... I say no
[Proteus] that is why I did not list it as a need be
[Proteus] does the erbil need to be implementated... I say it is not holding anything up
[Proteus] is the BUDGET a must... I say yes... as the budget holds the funding from the ministry of finance to support the cbi mechanism
[Proteus] the change of any monetary system in any country is not a FLICK of the SWITCH
[Proteus] there are many items that need to happen in succession for the sucessful change of any monetary system to happen
[Enoch8] Agree with that one 4 sure Proteus.
[Proteus] Enochs back
[Enoch8] No switch
[B.I.W.] ok
[B.I.W.] i will go with some things i think are a issue
[B.I.W.]
LINK [B.I.W.] The objective of the Emergency Banking Sector Reform Project in Iraq is to strengthen the supervisory framework for financial intermediation and to build capacity of financial institutions to support implementation of first phase of the Iraq banking reform strategy specifically, the operation will focus on four main components: (i) institutional and operational restructuring of the two main state-owned commercial banks (Rasheed Bank and Rafidain Bank); (ii) financial restructuring of the two mai.
[B.I.W.] here is the 10 million dollar loan
[B.I.W.]
http://siteresources.worldbank.org/I...ingSep2010.pdf [B.I.W.] here is the review from 2010
[B.I.W.] review from 2011
[B.I.W.] Institutional and operational restructuring of the two state-owned commercial banks, procurement status is as follows: (i) progress made in signing the contract with United Ramin Information Technology Solutions (RITS) for providing training services for development of computer skills for Rasheed Bank and Rafidain Bank. The contract value is US$ 325,000 signed on May 8, 2011 and the consultants commenced work in Baghdad on May 22, 2011 with duration of 18 weeks to complete; (ii) training for Branch Mangers. Last batch of training was completed on May 9, 2011; (iii) training of Human Resources. The training of the second and final batch of trainees with the Egyptian Banking Institute (EBI) was commenced on June 19, 2011 and will be completed by July 12, 201, iv) Contract with PWC for restructuring of the internal audit and compliance for the value of US$ 1.26 million with commencement date of mid July 2011, and (v) contract with IBTCI for the value of US$ 1.18 million. The contract’s c
[B.I.W.] imho the banking is still an issue
[B.I.W.] second
[B.I.W.]
http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/fin_sanctions_iraq.htm [B.I.W.] is the issues with the unsc and all the rules such they have installed
[B.I.W.] this is not any any order sorry
[B.I.W.] i am just rambling
[B.I.W.] intill the issues with kuwait are fully taken care of, i feel it is a big issue
[Proteus] I do agre that those items are surrounding an event...
[B.I.W.] yes they get 1 billion every 3 months but here are other factors like borders and some jewels they want back
[Proteus] but do they PREVENT an event from happening... this is not fully convincing to me!
[B.I.W.] ok
[B.I.W.] last 1
[Proteus] yeah
[B.I.W.] V
[B.I.W.]
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Executive_Order_13303 [Enoch8] IMO.... based on the CBI has said numerous times since Sept 2010, that they need legislation for the CBI Plan.
[B.I.W.] , George W. Bush, President of the United States of America, find that the threat of attachment or other judicial process against the Development Fund for Iraq, Iraqi petroleum and petroleum products, and interests therein, and proceeds, obligations, or any financial instruments of any nature whatsoever arising from or related to the sale or marketing thereof, and interests therein, obstructs the orderly reconstruction of Iraq, the restoration and maintenance of peace and security in the country, and the development of political, administrative, and economic institutions in Iraq. This situation constitutes an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States and I hereby declare a national emergency to deal with that threat.
[B.I.W.] just wanted to say this ex order will not expire
[B.I.W.] unless they want it to
[B.I.W.] last thing i will add
[B.I.W.] if they do some thing in iraq with their currency this link is all you need
[B.I.W.]
http://www.currency-iso.org/ [B.I.W.] sign up they will send you a email when iraq and the imf issue a new currnecy code and it gets filed at the BIS
[B.I.W.] IT FREE
[B.I.W.] CODE
[B.I.W.] chuckles would like to give your views on some things thst need to happen dont have to be in any order guys
[Chuckles] sure but mines short
[B.I.W.] please welcome chuckles owner of dinar dater
[Chuckles] IMO, it almost seems since the IMF has been busy dealing with the Euro crisis so they're basically telling Iraq to increase their oil production by encouraging them to increase their budget. I'm sure the IMF needs to meet their numbers as well. Personally I think it's good news.
[*Tenmillion] welcome Chuckles
[B.I.W.] guy like us looking for real facts
[B.I.W.] welcome sir
[Chuckles] Hey BIW
[Chuckles] Ten, Dreamin
[Chuckles] The greater the pressure Iraq has to increase their oil output and build up their infrastructure they'll clearly have to raise their budget for infrastructure, so the more they increase production the more valuable the Dinar should be (given there are no changes to the amount printed and reported). They have to do something right? They either have to print more and keep on keeping on, or change the current exchange rate of the dinar. So today their budget this year is roughly 120 billionish and they currently produce roughly 2.5 million BBD right? So what is the dinar worth? 1170.
[Dreamin] Hello Chuckles
[Chuckles] I have just have a few scenarios
[Chuckles] Scenario 1: OK, so in the next year Iraq gets oil production up to around 5 million BBD and they do nothing with the currency as it stands now, there GDP doubles, and they haven't over printed their currency into hyper inflation. So now what should the current exchange rate be? I would say at least twice as much of what it currently is? I've always thought the GDP and currency tend to be pretty closely tied? So as Iraq increase production we slowly see a rise in the value of the dinar, it could take 1 to 2 years, 10, or 20 but the dinar should still raise in value of the years assuming Iraq maintains economic stability and remains secure.
[Chuckles] Scenario 2: Iraq decides to change the rate of their currency, but not re denominate. They say hey it's .03,.20,3.22 whatever bring it on. Simple enough. Not really, but that conversation is too long.
[Chuckles] Scenario 3: Iraq declares that they are printing a whole new set of notes, you get a set period of time to bring in your x notes for y notes, and now y=?.
[Chuckles] I've just been looking at older docs seeing what we should see when Iraq is ready to do somethign with their currency
[Chuckles] an oldie
http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...ncy-reform.htm [Chuckles] well I'm done..lol
[B.I.W.]
http://gulfanalysis.wordpress.com/ [B.I.W.] good link to see what going on daily
[JayP] ah.. fun topic! sorry I stepped in a little late into the conversation
[JayP] in my opinion, the banking infrastructure, and getting citizens to deposit their money into the banks I believe is important..
[JayP] another item would be diversifying their economy to grow their GDP..
[Chuckles] and getting everyone to move to electronic banking, if the GOI still won't what hope is there for the citizens
[JayP] and the 3rd for me, and most importantly..
[JayP] is the reduction of the dinar in circulation
[Chuckles]
http://www.economywatch.com/economic...raq/year-2011/ [JayP] As far as the banking.. here is a document that talks about mobile banking that I was reading.. it is quite interesting, but the key here is where they talk about the banking infrastructure..
[JayP] [JayP] http://wikileaks.org/cab ··· 18.html#
[JayP] let me give you something specific in there that I found interesting..
[JayP] "¶3. (SBU) COMMENT: Getting the necessary regulatory, technical, and consumer protection infrastructure in place for mobile banking obviously will take some time. Delays, however, could lead the private sector and public to find more immediate workarounds, which may lead to prudential and security vulnerabilities. Once operational, the attractiveness of mobile banking may spur many more Iraqis to move their money into the formal financial system, a boon to economic development. "
[JayP] let me give you something specific in there that I found interesting..
[JayP] "¶3. (SBU) COMMENT: Getting the necessary regulatory, technical, and consumer protection infrastructure in place for mobile banking obviously will take some time. Delays, however, could lead the private sector and public to find more immediate workarounds, which may lead to prudential and security vulnerabilities. Once operational, the attractiveness of mobile banking may spur many more Iraqis to move their money into the formal financial system, a boon to economic development. "
[JayP] This makes sense to me, and helps explain why this is such a big deal I think..
[JayP] as far as the auctions..
[JayP] I think that there is a bit of confustion there in my opinion...
[JayP] there are some out there that I have seen telling folks that they have been reducing the amount of dinar from circulation..
[JayP] and that is why the auction numbers have been so high as of the last month...
[JayP] Chuckles and I have been discussing that some, and I have been looking at some articles in the last month, and chuckles provided a couple of real intreresting ones yesterday..
[JayP] I think that these explain the auctions fairly well..
[JayP] first there was this one..
http://www.tensdinarden.com/showthre...of-Iraqi-dinar [JayP] this one to me explains it all right there, that these auctions are high in order to help stabilize the market rate of the dinar
[JayP] and the key here is to stabilize, not rv the CBI rate
[Enoch8] Top 3 things that need to happen for RV ?
[Enoch8] OK...... sit quiet and think for a minute.....
[B.I.W.] no bro you get 10
[B.I.W.] eheh
[Enoch8] There are not 10 reasons
[Enoch8] The only things that matters really is that CBI needs legislation.
[Enoch8] That falls to Parliament.
[Enoch8] That IS the delay
[Enoch8] Simple as that.
[*Tenmillion] hi Marcus!
[Enoch8] Now do you recall? In Sept 2010 CBI stated they needed legislation?
[Enoch8] Saleh said that again a couple weeks ago...and defined it.... made it very clear.
[Enoch8] OK.... 1. Parliament to pass the CBI Law
[Enoch8] 2. Bonds and Securities Markets.
[Enoch8] That is how it gets paid for.
[Enoch8] 3. Welllll not sure on that for now.... so I am going to stick with those 2 items.
[Enoch8] I have reasons for saying that Erbil.... HCL.... Kuwait.... UNSC.... all do not matter so much.... but need to be addressed.... yet do not hold up RV
[Enoch8] I would say 3. would be IMF Article VIII compliance, because it directly effects the Primary and Secondary Markets.
[Enoch8] Because that directly affects WTO compliance for final ascession.
[Enoch8] IRQ and Oil nations do not qualify for GATT Exclusions....
[Enoch8] so, they must be IMF Art VIII compliant.
[Enoch8] Some of the other issues.... I do nort want to minimize their respective importance4...
[Enoch8] they all factor in.
[B.I.W.]http://www.imf.org/external/np/sec/pr/2011/pr11465.htm
[Enoch8] Now there are literally 3 years worth of links and documents to study to catch up with what I just said.
[Enoch8] It is no overnight matter.
[Enoch8] So...... BIW and JayP just posted some good links.....
[Enoch8] I wont overload you all with more at this time.
[Enoch8] I would appreciate the question later as to why.
[Enoch8] So done for now... for time and allowing Marcus a few.
[*Tenmillion] top 3 factors for an RV to occur
[B.I.W.] well we were sharing what we think
[MarcusCurtis] oh ok
[MarcusCurtis] well enoch on I are on the same page on a lot of this stuff
[MarcusCurtis] we have shared much information
[MarcusCurtis] but to recap
[MarcusCurtis] 1. CBI law needs to be passed by parliament
[MarcusCurtis] I think in that you may find provisions for the lower denoms which are NOT printed yet
[MarcusCurtis] 2. Bonds need to take off
[MarcusCurtis] I read about 3 articles in the mainstream news about Iraq reaching into new bond markets abroad
[MarcusCurtis] read them this week in fact
[MarcusCurtis] 3 Iraq must prove it can stand on its own two feet and the government becomes a bit more stable
[MarcusCurtis] those are my top three
[*Tenmillion] ty Marcus
[MarcusCurtis] there are a ton of details in there
[MarcusCurtis] It all depends on what happens
[Proteus] The value of national currency of each country depends on a myriad of factors among them economic situation of the country in the world, efficiency of the government and securing the costs, political, legal and judicial stability for attracting foreign investments,
[MarcusCurtis]
http://www.kiplinger.com/businessres...u-in-2012.html [Proteus] observing the international law and regulation and being in line with international changes, etc.
[Proteus] if i remember there is not even a law in the constitution that
[*Tenmillion] cool Marcus!
[Proteus] stipulates that the IQD is to be uses as the PRINCIPLE CURRENCY of TRADE within the country
[Enoch8] Right..... currency reform has to happen before printing new money.
[Proteus] you got it
[Proteus] but you guys are forceing me to tell reasons...
[Proteus] that i was holding back for the great debate
reasons...
[B.I.W.] raq Debt Beats Treasuries for Templeton’s Hasenstab (Update3) By Michael Patterson - June 11, 2009 14:45 EDT June 11 (Bloomberg) -- Michael Hasenstab is betting on Iraqi and Malaysian debt to boost returns for his top-ranked Templeton Global Bond Fund, while shunning U.S. Treasuries, U.K. gilts and Japanese bonds.
[Enoch8] G Bonds and Securities have to be in place in world markets to cover the Circulation Liability.
[B.I.W.] here are the guysbuying iraq bonds
[Proteus] and the articles today said
[Chuckles] MOF auctions
[Chuckles] selling off GOI debt
[Proteus] that the means to change the currency...lets see how they phrased it...
[Proteus] He Jubouri that "the project will cost U.S. $ 150 million, and this little amount will be offset by the profits derived by the World Bank and the State Treasury of traders who Sistgnon the U.S. dollar, which they preferred for their small size and high value, and Istbdoulh currency of the new Iraqi.
[Enoch8] The auctions are mostly stabilization programs.
[Chuckles] yup
[Proteus] so the auctions... that are held by the CBI
[Proteus] they are for many reasons
[B.I.W.] i think they are a tool the cbi uses to control to flow of dinar
[Proteus] to generate profit from the 13 dinars per dollar exchange
[Proteus] to stabilize the rate
[B.I.W.] there for controling money suppy
[Proteus] and actually to curb inflation
[Enoch8] More than that BIW..... the use tactics like sterilization to stabilize the exchange rate.
[Proteus] as they can flood the market with currency and get the rate to go yup or down
[Proteus] and they will affacet the inflation of the market
[Enoch8] Or revrese liquidity..... circulation and liquidity balances.
[Proteus] yes exactly
[B.I.W.] and i think the (000) panic the avg iraqi into sellingtheir dinar for dollars
[B.I.W.] then you see the money changers going to the cbi to buy dollar
[JayP] 2 more good links regarding the recent CBI auctions folks should keep to read after this chat:
[Enoch8] Maybe that is just a simple way to explain it.
[JayP]
http://almadapaper.net/ ··· id=56989
[JayP]
http://www.sotaliraq.com ··· ighHhRo1
[Proteus] Removing zeroes from national currency is a tool for governments’ support of the strength of currency policies. This measure has an important role in boosting public confidence in governments.
[Proteus] In democratic regimes, removing zeroes from national currency can play a significant role in re-election of a particular party. In contrast, if people lose their confidence in national currency,
[Enoch8] What the people in country do with dinars is small % of what the world markets hold in dinar.
[Proteus] they will start using foreign currencies, particularly as they have more prestige, and this leaves enormous economic
[Proteus] and psychological pressures on governments. Therefore, the economic policies of governments will be influenced by international financial markets and
[Enoch8] It is much more important that the TRade Partners have stability.
[Proteus] foreign central banks will affect the economic policies of the country in question. Therefore, removing zeroes will prevent the penetration of foreign currencies in the economy and the consequences.
[Enoch8] That is imf and wto
[Proteus] Removing zeroes from national currency is more a political measure from the governments rather than an expert and technical one and is considered to be part of the package of economic reforms.
[MarcusCurtis]
http://www.economywatch.com/economy-...aws.19-12.html [Enoch8] The world markets.... IE Secondary Markets are enormous by comparison to what is held by Iraqis
[Proteus] I'm done...
[Proteus] thanks for letting me interject
[MrRich] okay, here's what I think
[*Tenmillion] ok
[MrRich] I think
[MrRich] it's called speculation
[MrRich] for a reason
[MrRich] we're speculating that they're not going to do what they say they're going to do
[MrRich] because what they say they're going to do is RD
[MrRich] don't let anybody fool you with their fancy translators
[MrRich] they're describing a lop
[MrRich] but maybe they won't
[MrRich] and if they don't we might make a lot of money
[MrRich] but like CHuckles says you should only risk what you wouldn't mind blowing on a weekend in Vegas
[Chuckles] Vegas rules
[MrRich] because this is a gamble
[MrRich] and that's all I have to say about that!
[MrRich] (forrest gump voice)
[MarcusCurtis] [MarcusCurtis] http://bvawe.wordpress.c ··· -part-7/
[MarcusCurtis] thats what I think about an RD
[*Tenmillion] Thank you special guests for being here! This was a great informational chat!
[JayP] Ten.. I need to run for the evening.. I just want to thank you for setting this up.. Folks, this is bar none the best group of dinar minds there is out there. Listen to these folks you see here tonight, as they can give true hope for this investment without the false hype and false info
[JayP] take what you have and will see here tonight, and learn from it.. ask questions, even afer you go back and read this guys.. it will help all of us in the end with the right questions asked!
TensDinarDen~ 
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